Interview with Feriel Lalami, political scientist and PhD in sociology

There needs to be interaction between feminist demands in the country of origin and feminist demands in France, Lalami claims, as this is a necessary step to remove obstacles and inequalities that weigh on immigrant women.

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Feriel Lalami is a political scientist and a PhD holder in sociology. She is the author of a number of books and articles on the status of women and feminist movements in the Maghreb. She believes that the interaction between feminist demands in the country of origin and feminist demands in France is a necessary step to remove obstacles and inequalities that weigh on immigrant women. The bottom-line demand being autonomous status for migrant women.

The immigration bill announced by the French government does not seem to introduce anything new related to the status of migrant women and women of immigrant background. What is your reading of this bill at this point?

We must start by remembering that 52% of newcomers to France are women.

Among other things, the bill aims to make immigration selective. It’s not only a question of siphoning off the important professions as they relate to economic development (doctors and computer scientists for example), but also the jobs described as “under tension.” Care jobs, on the other hand, are not attractive professions because they are difficult and have low wages. This is the sector through which women from the poorest countries will be solicited. The number of Filipinas working all around the world is illustration enough. They work as nannies for the rich families that employ and sometimes exploit them. But at what cost? They have to take care of the family’s children when they’ve left their own children back home, all to send some savings back to their countries to help support their whole families. Their salaries are derisory and the working conditions degrading; such is the harsh reality of personal care professions.

When it comes to the importation of highly skilled professions, wealthy countries do not realize the boomerang effect this produces: by depriving local populations of conditions needed for development, applications to leave will only multiply since the socioeconomic fabric has been impoverished.

Their salaries are derisory and the working conditions degrading; such is the harsh reality of personal care professions.

When it comes to the importation of highly skilled professions, wealthy countries do not realize the boomerang effect this produces: by depriving local populations of conditions needed for development, applications to leave will only multiply since the socioeconomic fabric has been impoverished.

Apart from a few initiatives, particularly taken by associations, the issue of migrant women’s rights is not a priority in France in the public debate on immigration, which is dominated by the right and far right. How can you explain such an absence of feminist discourse?

The feminist movement in France focuses more on violence against women and economic discrimination—wage inequality in particular. And yet, the question of migrant women falls under both these themes! But even though some associations like APEL-Egalité and Rajfire, to name a couple, have been bringing up this issue for many years, it is not discussed enough. The main demand is for migrant women to have autonomous status and the right to work. When women are in the process of family reunification or regularization in the event of marriage or PACS with a French man or a foreign resident, they are sometimes subjected to violence given the vulnerability of their situation and the possibility of being blackmailed, dependent as they are on their partner to obtain a residence permit. They do not know that being victims of violence can actually give them access to a residence permit.

Algerian and Moroccan women continue to be governed by bilateral agreements between their respective countries and France. Can the French State derogate from these agreements and apply common law to women who hold these two nationalities?

When it comes to family disputes, the courts are obliged to implement European law and case law. But the effects of the bilateral agreements, which are more restrictive for Moroccan women, have evolved as a result. So in cases of divorce, for example, the laws that women have recourse to will mitigate the consequences of a ruling pronounced in Algeria. The problem is that, their resources being generally limited, these women cannot always access effective legal advice for cases as complex as conflict-of-jurisdiction and the contravention of European public order. This has major repercussions in matters of divorce pertaining to maintenance obligations.

It’s really striking when you look at the pension law. We don’t talk enough about how much the increase in the age of retirement affects migrant women.

Is their situation in France not ultimately just another example of the loop of discrimination and inequality that women suffer from in these two countries?

Absolutely. Take the example of unemployment. Female foreign residents are more affected by it than men: compared to men with residence permits, twice as many women with residence permits are unemployed.

That’s why the struggles are inseparable. Migrant women are primarily affected by struggles in their countries of origin, trying to change discriminatory laws such as the Algerian Family Code. But this is also the case in the host country, the laws of which are laced with exploitation. It’s really striking when you look at the pension law. We don’t talk enough about how much the increase in the age of retirement affects migrant women. They join the workforce later than the average person, so not only will their pensions be much less than others’, but they themselves will be worn down by the arduousness of their jobs.

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